Curse

pumpkin pie · Apr 24, 2008, 04:22 PM // 16:22

lets get this out of the way: this is NOT i REPEAT, NOT a "Is nerfing good or bad" thread.

I am just wandering IF all the used to be and has since been nerfed over powering build were not nerfed, could they be use against each other successfully?

for example (noob alert, none-pvp person asking) if necro's soul reaping were not nerf, can those build that was thought to be over power in PvP be use against the ranger pew pew (i think its Broad Head Arrow or somthing, the recently thought to be too good) build and won?

hope you understand what I am asking, I was just thinking.

what do you think?

Malice Black · Apr 24, 2008, 04:23 PM // 16:23

SR took a hit, but all the crying about it was lame.

All builds have a counter. Good people learn them, bad people cry here.

carnage-runner · Apr 24, 2008, 04:32 PM // 16:32

... Good people cry there, bad people learn them here more like it.

Dr Strangelove · Apr 24, 2008, 04:52 PM // 16:52

Trying to read this hurt my brain.

shogun avatar · Apr 24, 2008, 05:00 PM // 17:00

people would cry a lot less about ursan, because there would be a lot more very powerfull builds out there. And i doubt that they would call it (ursan blessing) overpowered then.

(I remind you about armor stacking nerf, chain lightning nerf, and so forth..)

pumpkin pie · Apr 24, 2008, 05:01 PM // 17:01

you know,
those build that were so great once, using, soul reaping if they are still not nerf, will those build be able to counter the ranger BHA build that is the latest nerf.

:P~ just something I am thinking about. so you think they could? or not?

you know say skill bar A can heal very fast that it needs to be nerf for balance, and then they were nerf, then comes skill bar B that can kill very fast that if you have skill bar A you would be able to heal and stop skill bar B from killing so fast. but A was nerfed, see and the only thing that could have counter skill bar B was already nerfed.

so, logically, if skill bar A was not nerf, and then few months later skill bar B becomes popular, and could Skill Bar B and A be balance in PvP?

hahahaha :P~

Mohnzh · Apr 24, 2008, 05:06 PM // 17:06

Didn't I read an article about this concept recently? Basically there was a game that swore it would never nerf a skill, it would only buff others to match it. It failed miserably. The game was good to begin with, but because of one or two overpowered skills, they tried to adjust all others. Some of those they overadjusted, now they had to adjust everything else again. Always buffing. It never got balanced and eventually people quit playing. I think if nerfs had not been implemented, we simply wouldn't have the player base we have now. Two overpowered skill bars do not cancel each other out. They nerf when something has no reasonable counter. Therefore A =/= B, or at least that is what the developers conclude before nerfing.

Ate of DK · Apr 24, 2008, 05:07 PM // 17:07

I think there is a reason why most builds got nerfed in the first place. Which get often explained in the dev. updates on the official wiki.

Wondering if todays "overpowered" builds could match the former ones? Hard to tell. Easiest to say is that the current ones wouldn't excist if people could still play the old one that was called "overpowered" and easily rolled other teams...

pumpkin pie · Apr 24, 2008, 05:08 PM // 17:08

no, you misunderstand, and its not about weather nerfing is needed for a good game or not.

I am asking, whether skill bar A can be use successfully against skill bar B

A being skill bar that was once over powered and don't exist anymore, but if we use it can it counter, successfully, skill bar B
B being the latest over powered skill bar.

FoxBat · Apr 24, 2008, 05:13 PM // 17:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

for example (noob alert, none-pvp person asking) if necro's soul reaping were not nerf, can those build that was thought to be over power in PvP be use against the ranger pew pew (i think its Broad Head Arrow or somthing, the recently thought to be too good) build and won?

No. The old Icy Veins spike would mop the floor with turret rangers. Nerfing super-overpower build A just means that slightly-less-overpowered build B comes to the surface.

pumpkin pie · Apr 24, 2008, 05:14 PM // 17:14

Oh i see,

thanks, now I can go sleepy bye

it just bugs me.

bywa · Apr 24, 2008, 06:11 PM // 18:11

heh if signet of ghostly might wouldn't be nerfed and it still would kill everyone in 10sec there will be no point in comparing it to other "powering builds"

bhavv · Apr 24, 2008, 06:35 PM // 18:35

There was absolutely nothing wrong with soul reaping untill factions introduced ritualists to the game.

There was nothing wrong with ritualists untill Anet buffed channeling.

There was nothing too imba about monks untill NF introduced Healers Boon and Energising Finale.

There was nothing wrong with Watch Yourself untill paragons.

And paragons were just broken from the start.

After all the fixes that the game required, Anet broke the game beyond repair.

I tried WoW and Lotro as alternatives, but they didnt keep me hooked. But AoC is looking fantastic and should get me away from guild wa....

Hold on a minute, I havnt played GW for a week because of how much I've been absorbed buy the AoC forums, and I dont feel like logging on whatsoever.

GW... addiction.... gone... Aoc... addiction.... starting.

Dr Strangelove · Apr 24, 2008, 06:42 PM // 18:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

There was absolutely nothing wrong with soul reaping untill factions introduced ritualists to the game.

Bloodspike with ranger spirits

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

There was nothing wrong with ritualists untill Anet buffed channeling.

Defensive spirit spam

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

There was nothing too imba about monks untill NF introduced Healers Boon and Energising Finale.

Energy Drain/Mantra of Recall

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

There was nothing wrong with Watch Yourself untill paragons.

Buff to earshot range

Creeping Carl · Apr 24, 2008, 07:14 PM // 19:14

Dont know what the point of this thread was. Even if say all the previously overpowered skils/builds/mechanics were equally overpowered, it still leaves a bigger slew of non-overpowered builds being overshadowed by those overpowered builds.

Balancing by both nerfing and buffing is the best way to balance, rather than balancing by one extreme of only buffing or only nerfing. It would be idiotic to buff everything if just one skill was overpowered instead of just nerfing that one skill.And before someone cries about GW ONLY nerfing, they've buffed plenty, probably as much as they nerf.

bhavv · Apr 24, 2008, 07:15 PM // 19:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Strangelove

Bloodspike with ranger spirits

Defensive spirit spam

Energy Drain/Mantra of Recall

Buff to earshot range

Those are all very nice examples of ordinary, normal powered builds. Nothing was imba about them. Necro Spike needed 7-8 necros to work meaning that healing was weak. Most blood spikes were easy to kill with a good balanced team.

Defensive Spirits were never imba. They are easy to kill and the protective ones dont even last that long in 8v8 PVP.

Boon Prot monks were a lot less imba then the monks NF gave us (Healers boon and LoD)

And buff to earshot range did nothiong to watch yourself. The skill was perfectly fine untill Paragons could keep it up all the time, add to their 80+ armor, and gain energy for using it.

Ralphy Boy · Apr 24, 2008, 09:59 PM // 21:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

lets get this out of the way: this is NOT i REPEAT, NOT a "Is nerfing good or bad" thread.

I am just wandering IF all the used to be and has since been nerfed over powering build were not nerfed, could they be use against each other successfully?

for example (noob alert, none-pvp person asking) if necro's soul reaping were not nerf, can those build that was thought to be over power in PvP be use against the ranger pew pew (i think its Broad Head Arrow or somthing, the recently thought to be too good) build and won?

hope you understand what I am asking, I was just thinking.

what do you think?

Invicimonks would rape prices, Jaggedway will be alive again, balthazar's aura would stack, energizing finale sor incoming teams will be invincible again, DWAY would be alive, everyone would be running Shardway (mind you Shardway can't be killed with Diversion), blah blah blah blah blah BLAH.